Farenheit 9-11

[Chew13acca]

I saw the movie a week ago.


WOW.

It supports the troops, shows exactly how stupid bush is, and is funny all at once.

Post what you think HERE!

[Juggatard]

I think you're too young to be caring at all.

[Junior Asparagus]

What would make you too young to care? How could someone be too young?

I think we had a thread about this before. It was a good movie. Just don't take Michael Moore's word as gospel, as he's quite...enthusiastic about his views.

[Juggatard]

Well, I mean, one. He's 14 and he shouldnt be seeing R rated movies. They're rated R for a reason.

Also, I mean. He still has his teen years ahead of him. Why worry about something that wont affect him, until he's old enough for the draft of coursE :P

[Junior G-Man]

I think you're too young to be caring at all.

Umm isnt it a good thing that someone at 14 is actually interested in politics and world events.

[Coppatop]

It was good… although it was more of an anti Bush film than a documentary on 9/11, which kinda irked me a bit. Moore delved into artistic filmmaking for parts of it. (After the intro and titles, for example.we're treated to a black screen and only the audio of the moments when the two planes struck the Twin Towers. It's actually very gripping. Other times he juxtaposes very heart-wrenching agony with crass comedy, which is very disturbing but effective.) A lot of the very real and publicly known connections between the Bushes and the bin Ladens, and the House of Saud, of course. Put together in condensed format. He of course ascribes more sinister motives to things than reality should allow for, but makes his case using real evidence. Footage of the Iraq war - of lives lost on both sides - and the very graphic carnage - is not easy to watch. He does the one thing that always pisses me off, and pulls off an "in your face" publicity stunt at the end. I hate when he does that. He wouldn't be such a bloody hack if he did that. The movie does a good job of pointing out Bush’s mistakes and flaws, other times it swings too far and makes weak, easily refutible attacks based largely on speculation. In short, it's a Michael Moore movie. And for the record, the theatre I saw it in was packed. *

* taekn from muh el jay.

[Stax Kazama]

I haven't seen it yet, I'll rent it or something.
Micheal Moore is a disgusting, self-righteous ,pompous asshole.

I saw Bowling for Columbine at the avon when it came out, and it did rasie some good questions and make some good points (my favorate part was the interview w/ Marilyn Manson). However, It also lied, and attempted to show Moore as some kind of "great person" or "superhero to the public" but failed miserably as it just looked as if he loved being in front of the camera, which is probably the case.

The whgole thing in the beggining about getting the gun at the bank was completly staged. Yes, you get a free gun, but it takes weeks of extensive background testing, and all of the other things required for getting a gun. ALso, they don't have guns at the bank, you have to go to a designated gun supplier.
And the statistics shown during the movie were greatly and inaccurately changed, to make it look the way he wanted.

I'm just saying to anyone who sees his movies: don't belive it all.

I think the man is a piece of shit to be honest (especially after the whole thing w/ him knowing about the mistreatment of iraqi prisoners and not saying anything about it b/c it could affect the publicity of his movie or whatever).

But Bush is a worthless piece of shit too, I don't need a movie to tell me that.

[Bryan]

Umm isnt it a good thing that someone at 14 is actually interested in politics and world events.
Yeah, that is rare, and is something I respect. In a world with a young generation that really "doesn't give a shit about anything", it's nice to see people actually caring about our current events. But what I do want to see is that you view these movies, form your own opinion based on research and experience and then go out and do something with that. I know you're only 14 Chewie, but hopefully you'll vote when you're 18.

Maybe there would have been a chance that we would have gotten Gore, if more of our generation would have voted. But the fact of the matter is, is that Bush won, and the people that could of voted but didn't are the ones complaining the most about it. Make the most out of your vote, get off your ass and do something about it. Kerry, Bush, Nader.. whoever you pick, at least pick somebody. Don't just sit there and not vote, and then go on complaining about the president that should have never made it in, because you had your chance to make a difference but made no effort to on the day that it matters most.

[Juggatard]

Meh. At least the movie was funny guys am i rite

[Yao]

I may be a wet the bed liberal, but i don't really stand for what Moore thinks. In the end, he's just a fat guy who thinks he speaks for everyone. I was all gung ho with him, until i went to a website that outlined the lies and inaccuracies in Bowling for Columbine. Moore is like that girl in high school. Sure she has her own share of problems, but she blows them up and makes sure everyone knows every lil detail. Stax, you're the (wo)man, because you took the words right out of my mouth

[Junior Asparagus]

Why worry about something that wont affect him, until he's old enough for the draft of coursE :P

It still affects you, even if you're not going to br drafted.

[Garrett]

Yeah, I'm 14 and I care because my brother could be drafted. Luckily he's going to college in Canada so if they do want to draft him he'll just drop his American citizenship but...

I CARE! :D

[Craz]

It still affects you, even if you're not going to br drafted.

Uhh ohh, chris Guen cant spell :P

The movie was good in terms of the cinematography, but the way it was presented in the first half, it was kinda....pointless rants against bush. Though he did bring up points about terrorists could easily move in through Oregon and such. I liked it, though Moore could of defintly approced it at a different angle and be more effective. Though the guy has balls, ill give him that.

[Junior G-Man]

Not that Im a huge micheal moore fan or anything, but I've heard people describe Farenheit 9/11 as "left wing propaganda" and that "we dont need propaganda in these harsh times" (both actual quotes). But, then person X goes on to describe "Well Bill O'Reilly said this and Bill O'Reilly said that and he's on the radio so he must be right" (not an actual quote). I mean, am I the only one that sees the massive double-standard here. Moore's movie is "Propaganda", yet people like Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity, and Micheal Savage (who is, by far, the biggest idiot in radio) are just pumping out nothing but "good ol' american values" by going balls to the wall with radical right wing inaccurate BS.

Man, I need a CD player in my car

[Bryan]

Not that Im a huge micheal moore fan or anything, but I've heard people describe Farenheit 9/11 as "left wing propaganda" and that "we dont need propaganda in these harsh times" (both actual quotes). But, then person X goes on to describe "Well Bill O'Reilly said this and Bill O'Reilly said that and he's on the radio so he must be right" (not an actual quote). I mean, am I the only one that sees the massive double-standard here. Moore's movie is "Propaganda", yet people like Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity, and Micheal Savage (who is, by far, the biggest idiot in radio) are just pumping out nothing but "good ol' american values" by going balls to the wall with radical right wing inaccurate BS.

Man, I need a CD player in my carNothing is unbias. And this proves it, I'd go on about this, but everything I could have said I already said up in my other post.
Make the most out of your vote, get off your ass and do something about it.I know I will.

[Craz]

Its too bad that i miss the cut of date for the election by about 2 weeks :(

[Yao]

from what i hoid, no matter what standpoint you have, it will be stronger after seeing the movie. Left wing folks will be motivated to do more for their anti-war causes, and the right wing will find it disgusting and want to prevent propaganda like that from corrupting. So seems it's win win for that fat homeless guy who made it

[Juggatard]

There is no winning.

[Sal the Ref]

I saw the movie...I'm not much of a moviegoer, but I'd read his books (more on that later) which is why I wanted to go. I thought it was compelling, to say the least, but there is one think that irked me. I didn't vote for Bush (like most Americans) and I think he's a greedy, war-mongering moron, but, in the spirit of fairness, I think some of his quotes were taken out of context. Moore's books (both "Stupid White Men" and "Dude, Where's My Country?") were actually a lot more balanced and critical of the political landscape and its inhabitants as a whole and I wish that he'd reflected that POV in the movie. I do think Moore makes a lot of good points, but I neither agree with him 100%, nor think he is always right. Nobody is.

And I think it's impressive that a 14 year old gives a damn enough about the US to be aware of politics. There should be more 14 year olds seeing movies like this.

[Stax Kazama]

Oh yeah, props for being 14 and actually caring about issues like this. Most kids that age don't give a shit or even try to learn more about whats happening in the world.

Juggs, why must you try to lower the intelligence in every thread you post in? Its sad really.

[shinigami_2057]

Oh yeah, props for being 14 and actually caring about issues like this. Most kids that age don't give a shit or even try to learn more about whats happening in the world.

Juggs, why must you try to lower the intelligence in every thread you post in? Its sad really.

Jugg> YHBT. YHL. HAND. :D

[CreemyNougat]

Bush is the driving force behind the little motivation I have to register.
I'm only one vote, and RI is only 4, but I'll be miffed if that moron gets reelected by one vote from our state.
I don't much like Kerry from what I've seen...but still. He's not Bush, and that's a plus.

[Chew13acca]

Of course i care what's going on. IF he keeps going, then almost all of the money i make in the future will be in taxes for the war, and I WON"T BE ABLE TO PLAY DDR, I"LL BE SO POOR!

That's why we gotta vote him out NOW! For DDR, for IIDX, For PoP'n, Even for PIU and Game Zone (the place across the street from TGA)

WE GOTTA BE ABLE TO STILL HAVE FUN IN OUR LIVES!

[Great For Dipping]

Of course i care what's going on. IF he keeps going, then almost all of the money i make in the future will be in taxes for the war, and I WON"T BE ABLE TO PLAY DDR, I"LL BE SO POOR!

That's why we gotta vote him out NOW! For DDR, for IIDX, For PoP'n, Even for PIU and Game Zone (the place across the street from TGA)

WE GOTTA BE ABLE TO STILL HAVE FUN IN OUR LIVES!

You have a really strange set of priorities.

[Juggatard]

I'd rather see a monkey in office than I would Bush.


Fixed for you, d00d.

[Juggatard]

Juggs, why must you try to lower the intelligence in every thread you post in? Its sad really.

Because, honestly. It's fun. And I like watching people like yourself trying to put me down on something I think is fun.

[Dr. J]

bush is stupid, i mean REALLY STUPID!

[Stax Kazama]

Because, honestly. It's fun. And I like watching people like yourself trying to put me down on something I think is fun.


Whatever.
You used to be really cool, what happened? Honestly I'd like to really know. Why are you treating us all like your enemy all of a sudden? How is being a complete asshole to all of your freinds (obviously you don't consider us that anymore for no good reason) fun?

[Juggatard]

Whatever.
You used to be really cool, what happened? Honestly I'd like to really know. Why are you treating us all like your enemy all of a sudden? How is being a complete asshole to all of your freinds (obviously you don't consider us that anymore for no good reason) fun?

Was I being an asshole to you? *shrug*

[Stax Kazama]

Was I being an asshole to you? *shrug*

Nice way of avoiding the question.

Not nessecarily, but I've seen you be an asshole to my freinds for no real reason before, and its uncalled for. If I see somebody being a dick to my freinds I'm not going to be ok with it obviously.

[Yao]

ok, we all know this thread isn't about Juggs. You folks wanna discuss it, please do it off the boards. This place is about the movie, and W., and why it's cool that 14 year olds care.


On a side note, I'm watching bowling for columbine again, and now it's just really bad, knowing the lies and crap. So much stuff is coincidental.

[Juggatard]

Nice way of avoiding the question.

Not nessecarily, but I've seen you be an asshole to my freinds for no real reason before, and its uncalled for. If I see somebody being a dick to my freinds I'm not going to be ok with it obviously.

So you're mad that I'm being a perpetual asshole to Nougat?

;_;

Ps, I'd like to thank everyone for making the thread topic change so easily.

[framerate]

i would rather have a guy that gets botox injections then daddys' little war mongrel (DUBYA!) in office.
thats my opinion, take it, leave it, whatever
________
Mercury Montclair Specifications (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Mercury_Montclair)

[Hi-C]

i hate bush and i would like to see a democrat, ( being kerry ) take office. since democrats are for the common person like most of us. not like those damn republicans who are for the wealthier people. i deffiently care about whats happening in our world today since someday ill be working and paying taxes and all that good stuff

[Yao]

not all republicans are bad people you know. Some of our best presidents were republicans. Lincoln for example

[Hi-C]

that be very true

[Craz]

What we need are more presidents that will get shit done. More pressidents like Teddy Roosevelt. To be honest, i dont like bush. I think he acts first, lies later. Though im not likeing Kerry much eather. Seems to be too much talk. Out of the lesser of two evils, id rather have a president that did something. Its a shame that these days being president is more of a status symbol rather than helping the country.

[Juggatard]

What we need are more presidents that will get shit done. To be honest, i dont like bush. I think he acts first, lies later.

Walking contradiction.

^_^;

[cwjalex]

I hate bush and i would like to see a democrat, ( being kerry ) take office. since democrats are for the common person like most of us. not like those damn republicans who are for the wealthier people. i deffiently care about whats happening in our world today since someday ill be working and paying taxes and all that good stuff

You are brainwashed by mainstream media, son...you want kerry to take office, a man who claims he is for the common man. How does someone who owns 5 multimillion dollar mansions, a private jet, a 50 million dollar yacht, know whats it like to be a "common person". Also, in all his years in the senate, he only supported one piece of legislation that failed miserably. In 2003, he missed 64% of the senate votes and over 13 weeks out of the year...i wouldn't mind having a job where i didn't have to show up for months out of the year and still get paid 200k. He voted for a 200 billion dollar decrease in intelligence and now blames lack of intelligence for our national security problems.

You bleeding heart liberals like to point out how that tax cuts favor the wealthy because they receive more money than the average middle class worker. No kidding, who do you think pays the most taxes? The founding fathers did not envision a free society where the central government takes almost 50% of the people's income in revenue (the highest tax bracket is almost 50%). I know what you are going to say, we need paved roads and good schools and yada yada blah blah blah. That is true, but we don't need government programs such as social security and the (current) welfare system. The government spends trillions of dollars every year for drug rehabilitation centers. Trillions of dollars that are coming out YOUR pocket(s). First of all, rehab centers only rehabilitate 13% of those admitted, second, I don't believe that my hard earned money should go to some wino down the street who is hepped up on cocaine. Why should the majority of society supplement those who can't manage their own lives? Sounds like socialism if you ask me.

[Yao]

I agree to a small extent. I'm only gonna cover the rehab thing, cuz we all know how much Yao loves drugs. Now we'll use this lil example. I know a guy who goes to a methadone clinic. While he is attending rehab, the government pays for pretty much everything. I don't feel that is right, because though he is going through a horrible thing, he's also getting a free ride. How is that supposed to rehabilitate him? He doesn't need a job, he doesn't need to support his kid, because the taxes taken out of my check do it for him. I don't feel that's right, because he can work. I think if there is some coke head out there who can't work yet, and really needs rehab, and due to that, just can't find a job, then i can understand paying.

Also, i would like to see where those rehab stats you got came from

[cwjalex]

i can't understand paying at all for rehab...every single drug user out there had the opportunity to walk away and not use drugs...they are victims of their own actions...what ever happened to personal responsibility where one takes responsibilty for their own actions and ceases to blame society or another medium for their own problems? And what if he grew up in a poor section of a city with bad influences and boo hoo hoo? Well nobody ever said that life was fair...there are plenty of rapists and murderers on the streets who grew up in abusive homes, do we condone their actions and release them free from punishment?

[Yao]

ya see, before i could have agreed with you. But now you're just being egotistical about it. Have you ever had a friend of family member go to rehab? I'm straight-edge, so i'm supposed to be "holier then thou" about these things, but i'm not. Some people don't choose to do drugs. There are a percentage of people who were forced to do drugs, literally held down. Or there are other whose parents did drugs, so they were born addicted. Drug use is far from being up to far with murder and rape. You're not taking into consideration that hardcore drug use creates a new person. They can not control their actions, the drugs do so. I don't think you know what drugs do to people.

[cwjalex]

i know exactly what drugs do to people...i started to get hooked on various narcotics because i had to take them when i had to have lung surgery three times...yeah they are strong and i was forced to take the medicine, but i got off them...i didn't start whining and blaming the drugs for all my problems...and dont think that the majority of users are "forced to" by the theory you hold that they are strapped down and forced to take all these drugs...many drugs users start by their own free will...and are you reading what you are typing? You are shifting responsibility...you are saying that its not the persons fault at all, that its all the drug's fault...so are we to condone any action a person commits while under the influence? I do not understand how i am being egotistical; I simply want people to take responsibilty for their own actions...I also realize there are a small, SMALL group of people who are genuine victims, where life just dealt them a crappy hand and numerous things worked out so they ended up using drugs...however i believe that this does not represent the majority.

[Yao]

How am i shifting responsibility? People who are on drugs genereally do not know what they are doing. No, i'm not condoning their actions, but you're implying that they don't deserve help, because they did it on their own free will. Alot of folks go to rehab on their own free will as well. And if not, you're saying that they don't deserve to get better. Have you no compassion for your fellow man? Drugs users are people too. People with problems. What about alcoholism? Do you believe in AA? Drug addiction is a disease. So under your logic, a teacher who got sick by being around sick children should not be treated, because she knew what she was getting in to.

[cwjalex]

you are shifting responsibility by saying its the drugs fault and not the user.

um, AA? ...alcoholic anonymous programs do not cost trillions of dollars a year.

drug addiction is not a disease. Cancer is a disease...Tuberculosis is a disease...drug addiction is not a disease...you can't will urself to driver cancer out of remission...however drug users can stop by a strong enough will.

"So under your logic, a teacher who got sick by being around sick children should not be treated, because she knew what she was getting in to."

please tell me how you can compare a teacher who is doing her job to educate the minds of the future to a hardcore drug user who shoots up just to make himself feel good...the teacher puts himself/herself in that situation to help others and there is nothing illegal about what she is doing...don't try to tell me most drug users do so with the intention of benefiting their fellow man...i also realize that you are missing my point entirely...im not sayin drug users shouldn't be helped...i'm saying the government shouldn't force its citizens to pay for their treatment...in the same way, i don't think the goverment should force its citizens to pay for the current welfare system...that doesn't mean i am a selfish prick who doesn't help out poor people...i give 10% of my income to my church...im not saying that to brag although many people give much more....but the point is that i give out of my OWN choice...not because someone is forcing me to

[Bryan]

I'm not willing to state my opinion on this. But:
drug addiction is not a disease. Cancer is a disease...Tuberculosis is a disease...drug addiction is not a disease...you can't will urself to driver cancer out of remission...however drug users can stop by a strong enough will.I do believe this.

[Yao]

i ain't gonna get anywhere in this argument, so suffice to say that drugs are a bitch. Period

[Ishbo]

i ain't gonna get anywhere in this argument, so suffice to say that drugs are a bitch. Period
I also agree with this.

[Juggatard]

ESS ECKS EEE.

am i rite?

[shinigami_2057]

Well, well. The internet strikes again

[Yao]

well well, quit post whoring.....post whores

[Juggatard]

well well, quit post whoring.....post whores

Your post had so much content, too!

[Yao]

As a mod, it is my responsibility to inform those who are violating the forums rules that they are doing as such. Since I am lacking a karma or warning button, I have to inform them through the forums. My post did have content, it told you to stop post whoring. Now, don't respond to this unless you have something of pertinence to say, involving either the movie, or the state of America. Thank you, and good day

[Juggatard]

The movie sucks.

And so doesnt Abe.

:)

[cwjalex]

heh, more of a ....discussion than an argument....but ur probably right...not going to go anywhere....and yes, drugs are a bitch....hmmmmm, this isn't really that pertinent...but when i was in the hospital i had to have multiple shots in my ass...and holy hell did it hurt....i've had hundreds of shots in my life but the ones in the ass hurt the most....and the nurse had a face that could stop a freight train...so that didn't help either....ok im going to stop.